Monday, June 27, 2022

Destruction, Part 7: Murder and Gain

Wherefore, O ye gentiles, it is wisdom in God that these things should be shewn unto you, that thereby ye may repent of your sins and suffer not that these murderous combinations shall get above you — which are built up to get power and gain — and the work, yea, even the work of destruction come upon you, yea, even the sword of the justice of the eternal God shall fall upon you to your overthrow and destruction if ye shall suffer these things to be.

—Ether 3:18 RE

Part 1 | Part 2 | Part 3 | Part 4 |Part 5 | Part 6 | Part 7 | Part 8

When Christ came to the Nephites at Bountiful, he came to the surviving remnant of a destroyed nation. Indeed, so great had been the Nephite destruction that the people who came to Bountiful to keep the required feast “were marveling and wondering one with another, and were shewing one to another the great and marvelous change which had taken place” (3 Nephi 5:1 RE). These changes were to the city, the landscape, even the very geography as fire, tempest, earthquake, floods, and volcanic eruptions had wiped out the wicked. 

But this particular destruction didn’t start as it ended, with natural disasters and entire cities laid waste in a moment. No, after the many ups and downs of the “Nephite pride cycle” this final destruction was ushered in by degrees at the beginning, and by something far more mundane than a massive display of nature’s power. 

What destroyed the Nephites was an idea—nothing more, and nothing less. Those who accepted and acted on the idea ultimately caused the deaths of millions and the destruction of an entire nation. The pen is indeed mightier than the sword, and ideas are more powerful than armies. We’ll get to the idea in due course, but first, let’s consider some history.

Dogs and Vomit

To understand the roots of the destruction before Christ’s coming, we should start with the day Christ was born. As you may recall, the faithful awaited Samuel’s sign of a night without darkness, while the wicked set a deadline for the sign to be given, or else all believers would be murdered. The miraculous sign that followed caused a general repentance, and nearly all the Nephites were converted to the Lord; but it didn’t last. 

Within three years, 

...the people began to forget those signs and wonders which they had heard, and began to be less and less astonished at a sign or a wonder from Heaven, insomuch that they began to be hard in their hearts and blind in their minds…And thus did Satan get possession of the hearts of the people again, insomuch that he did blind their eyes and lead them away to believe that the doctrine of Christ was a foolish and a vain thing.” (3 Nephi 1:8 RE)

Not many years later, the Gaddianton robbers had convinced and converted so many of the Nephites and Lamanites that they felt sufficiently powerful to make a play for the entire Nephite nation. It was only the righteousness of the Nephite Chief Judge, Lachoneous, that saved the nation from utter destruction. He gathered the people into one defensive body and declared repentance:

Yea, he said unto them, As the Lord liveth, except ye repent of all your iniquities and cry unto the Lord, that they would in no wise be delivered out of the hands of those Gaddianton robbers. And so great and marvelous were the words and prophecies of Lachoneus that they did cause fear to come upon all the people; and they did exert themselves in their might to do according to the words of Lachoneus. (3 Nephi 2:4 RE)

So complete were the preparations and so thorough the repentance that the gathered Nephites met the Gaddianton robbers in the strength of the Lord, repelled them for several years, and ultimately defeated them. They then caused the gospel to be preached among the vanquished robbers, resulting in the complete conversion of all the land. Here’s a description of the repentant Nephites that re-established peace:

And now behold, there was not a living soul among all the people of the Nephites who did doubt in the least the words of all the holy prophets which had been spoken, for they knew that it must needs be that they must be fulfilled. And they knew it must be expedient that Christ had come, because of the many signs which had been given according to the words of the prophets. And because of the things which had come to pass already, they knew it must needs be that all things should come to pass according to that which had been spoken. Therefore, they did forsake all their sins, and their abominations, and their whoredoms, and did serve God with all diligence, day and night. (3 Nephi 2:14 RE)

The miraculously established peace among these repentant people didn’t quite last four years. Soon, “some were lifted up unto pride and boastings…the people began to be distinguished by ranks…there became a great unequality in all the land, insomuch that the church began to be broken up…” and ultimately:

Satan had great power unto the stirring up of the people to do all manner of iniquity and to the puffing them up with pride, tempting them to seek for power, and authority, and riches, and the vain things of the world. And thus Satan did lead away the hearts of the people to do all manner of iniquity; therefore, they had not enjoyed peace but a few years. …they were in a state of awful wickedness. Now they did not sin ignorantly, for they knew the will of God concerning them, for it had been taught unto them; therefore, they did willfully rebel against God. (3 Nephi 3:3 RE)

Into this dire circumstance the Lord sent prophets, “preaching and testifying boldly of the sins and iniquities of the people, and testifying unto them concerning the redemption which the Lord would make for his people, or in other words, the resurrection of Christ; and they did testify boldly of his death and sufferings.” (3 Nephi 3:4)

This preaching, as it always does, angered the wicked, who responded by killing the prophets and forming a secret combination:

And they did enter into a covenant one with another, yea, even into that covenant which was given by them of old, which covenant was given and administered by the Devil to combine against all righteousness. Therefore, they did combine against the people of the Lord and enter into a covenant to destroy them and to deliver those who were guilty of murder from the grasp of justice which was about to be administered according to the law. (3 Nephi 3:5)

And now we’ve arrived at the idea I said we would reach in due course. It was put most plainly in the beginning, by none other than the original murderer, Cain: 

And Cain says, Truly I am Mahon, the master of this great secret — that I may murder and get gain; wherefore, Cain was called Master Mahon. (Genesis 3:9 RE)

It’s easy to consider this idea dismissively, as if it were so obvious. Yeah, you can kill someone and steal their stuff. This may be true enough, but such is the domain of amateurs and petty criminals. Cain, under the guidance of Lucifer, had a much greater goal in mind than merely obtaining property through murder. Ultimately, it was about gaining control over human souls. Cain’s murder was an attempt to displace Abel from the birthright position so that Cain could follow Adam as head of the human family with dominion over the earth. 

Naturally, Cain’s plan failed, as the outcome he sought could only be obtained in righteousness, but it didn’t keep him from laying out his secret plans in ways to inspire mankind to murder for the next 6000 years. 

Now, back to the Nephites. Here’s what happened next:

And they did set at defiance the law and the rights of their country. And they did covenant one with another to destroy the governor and to establish a king over the land, that the land should no more be at liberty, but should be subject unto kings. Now behold, I will shew unto you that they did not establish a king over the land, but in this same year, yea, the thirtieth year, they did destroy upon the judgment seat, yea, did murder the chief judge of the land. And the people were divided one against another and they did separate one from another into tribes, every man according to his family, and his kindred, and friends; and thus they did destroy the government of the land. (3 Nephi 3:5-6 RE)

The wicked combination intended to overthrow the current government and establish a king by murdering the chief judge. What they didn’t bank on was that the government had already been so weakened, and the fabric of society so frayed through wickedness that the murder of the chief judge—rather than resulting in a new government—resulted in no government at all. The people broke up into tribes and banded together for survival. 

And all this iniquity had come upon the people because they did yield themselves unto the power of Satan. And the regulations of the government were destroyed because of the secret combination of the friends and the kindreds of those who murdered the prophets. And they did cause a great contention in the land…and thus six years had not passed away since the more part of the people had turned from their righteousness, like the dog to his vomit or like the sow to her wallowing in the mire. (3 Nephi 3:6 RE)

The Nephites remained in this general state of wickedness and societal destruction for the next three years until the natural disasters at Christ’s death overtook and annihilated the wicked. Regarding those who had destroyed the government by murdering the chief judge, the Lord said the following: 

And behold, that great city Jacob-ugath, which was inhabited by the people of king Jacob, have I caused to be burned with fire because of their sins and their wickedness, which was above all the wickedness of the whole earth because of their secret murders and combinations, for it was they that did destroy the peace of my people and the government of the land. Therefore, I did cause them to be burned to destroy them from before my face, that the blood of the prophets and the saints should not come up unto me anymore against them. (3 Nephi 4:6 RE)

Chief Judges

In considering this particular round of Nephite destruction, it’s perhaps tempting to think the chief judge’s murder was a new idea, tried out by desperate revolutionaries in hopes of establishing a king. But this isn’t the case at all. Of the 12 named chief judges in the 90-plus-year history of the reign of the judges over the people of Nephi, fully five of them were murdered in office—always by secret combinations, always for the purpose of getting gain, and twice causing governmental collapse. That’s nearly half, folks. Might there be a lesson there for us? 

Here’s what I take from it: Those who submit themselves to Satan ultimately lust for power and control over others. This power lust drives increasingly desperate actions against any who stand in the way of the ambitious, until the ultimate solution presents itself to their minds: Murder those who stand in your way, and you will gain what you seek. 

The history of humanity most certainly bears this out. Those seeking power, wealth, gratification of lust, and control of the institutions that could deliver all these things have bathed the world in blood nearly continually, ever since Cain first demonstrated the technique. 

The pattern is SO strong, SO pervasive, SO commonly acted out on stages both public and private, that this idea explains nearly all murders committed among all humanity for the last 6000 years. 

And now I, Moroni, do not write the manner of their oaths and combinations, for it hath been made known unto me that they are had among all people; and they are had among the Lamanites. And they have caused the destruction of this people of whom I am now speaking, and also the destruction of the people of Nephi. And whatsoever nation shall uphold such secret combinations, to get power and gain, until they shall spread over the nation, behold, they shall be destroyed; for the Lord will not suffer that the blood of his saints which shall be shed by them shall always cry unto him from the ground for vengeance upon them and yet he avengeth them not. (Ether 3:18 RE, emphasis mine)

Indeed if such plans are had among all people, they are certainly had in our nation and in our day. Given the prophecies already upon us, and those that will shortly be fulfilled, we should not be surprised to find we are the most murderous of any people ever to exist.

Whoa, there’s an assertion for you. 

Blood of the Innocents

As I write this, our nation is wracked with a massive upheaval threatening what’s left of our societal stability and rule of law. The Supreme Court of the United States just overturned a 50-year-old, poorly reasoned, tortuously applied ruling that an implied right to privacy constituted a right to abortion at will. Or in plainer terms, the Supreme Court ruled that abortion is an issue for the states to settle through legislation at the state level. There is not now, and never has been a Constitutional “right” to abortion.

This certainly doesn’t end the legacy of killing the unborn in our country, but it brings the current chapter to a close, after the deaths of some 63 million unborn children, almost universally for the “gain” of those sponsoring, choosing, and performing the killing. 

Rather than dwell on the horrific legacy of abortion in our nation, or the affront and offense it is to our Heavenly Parents, I’ll instead focus on the actions of those participating in this combination. The pending Supreme Court opinion was intentionally leaked in early May—a breach so egregious that it has never happened before in our nation’s history. Since that time, those in favor of killing the unborn have become increasingly angry, violent, and unwilling to be governed.  

After the leak, pregnancy centers were vandalized. Demonstrations were organized. Open threats were issued against those who would dare suggest the killings ought to stop, or even be regulated by the states. The coming ruling was mischaracterized in the most inflammatory language possible, outright lies were published and repeated about it, and politicians, governments, media organizations, celebrities, and corporations all sought to use any means possible to intimidate both the Supreme Court and the nation, perhaps hoping enough fear would cause the court to change the opinion before it was officially published. 

In response, the moon hid her face on the night of May 15-16, in the longest lunar eclipse of this century. The last blood moon of this duration took place 33 years ago, in 1989. Perhaps take notice of that 33-year span.

In the run-up to the release of the Court’s opinion, we witnessed the Summer Solstice with its zenith of maximum light, commencing the gradual loss of light now underway. A few days later, we saw the alignment of all 5 visible planets in a rare viewing event. Curiously, the best day for their viewing featured the waning crescent Moon between Venus and Mars (standing in for Earth in the planetary order.) The fact that the Moon was a waning crescent demonstrates before all the assembled planetary heavenly hosts that the Earth is losing light. The Moon’s testimony, in relation to events on the ground, is ominous. 

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That very day, the Supreme Court issued its unchanged opinion, striking down Roe v. Wade and though many celebrated this monumental decision, the far more vocal, angry, graphic, vulgar, loud, noticeable, media-promoted demonstrations were by the pro-killing crowd. There was no civil, reasoned discussion or debate of this matter. Why engage in an intellectual discussion of case law, legal precedent, federalism, states rights, biology, fetal development, women’s rights, religion, godliness, morality, or any of the myriad other important facets of this question, when you can instead paint a vulgar sign, smear your crotch with red paint, and scream obscenities at peaceful passers-by while you vandalize a church to show your disdain for life and law all while standing in a state that still allows abortion!? 

  • We witnessed national elected representatives calling the Supreme Court illegitimate, and openly calling for its dissolution and the destruction of our constitutional government.
  • We witnessed politicians stating they would simply refuse to obey laws with which they disagreed, including laws that limit killing the unborn. 
  • We witnessed vandalism, burning and bombing of churches, medical facilities, pregnancy care centers, and pro-life organizations, most concentrated in states where abortion is still allowed and promoted.
  • We witnessed open calls for a national split, civil war, or at least violence against any who believe in the sanctity of life. 
  • We witnessed ongoing personal threats and verbal attacks against the Supreme Court Justices, which included publishing their home addresses and organizing demonstrations at their homes (which is blatantly and directly against federal law, but was not prosecuted and is instead openly promoted by the current White House administration.)
  • We witnessed holders of high public office proclaiming from the steps of the Supreme Court that the Justices must suffer consequences for their rulings. 
  • In summary, we witnessed public calls for violence against the chief judges. The baby killers are now vocally promoting the assassination of various Justices, and even their families. 

Murder to Get Gain

In short, those most interested in murdering to get gain have done the math, considered the makeup of the court, realize the impact of a single changed vote, and are now calling for the murder of a chief judge. At least one assassin set out with the intent and means to do just that, before ultimately being apprehended and charged. This ought to come as a gut kick to anyone who believes the warnings in the Book of Mormon. It certainly did to me. The death of one chief judge is as likely to upend our government and society as it was to upend the Nephite nation. And we know how that turned out.

What I found most shocking was not that abortion supporters are calling for the murder of a Supreme Court Justice, but rather that they are being so public about it. Guys, it’s supposed to be a secret combination—remember? What, haven’t you read the book?

A recent poll by the leftist Southern Poverty Law Center found broad support for political violence, most particularly among younger people. Take a look at their findings, below:

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As you can see, the under-50 demographic of both major political parties expresses impressive levels of support for political assassinations, with nearly half of respondents among some demographics in favor. Such poll numbers ought to have Lucifer positively giddy with excitement. Hell, he’s polling even better than the president. 

All sarcasm aside, it’s clear we’re in deep trouble. Though overturning Roe v. Wade was certainly a positive step, it was taken by the same court that widely refused to consider the rights of those who object to forced experimental vaccination on religious grounds. Far from being the harbinger of a better future for society, it appears that the true legacy of the decision may ultimately have little to do with halting abortion, and far more to do with creating greater division, violence and destruction in what’s left of our nation. 

The pre-crucifixion Nephite nation, in a whiplash-inducing swing went from full conversion and righteousness to vile wickedness, loss of government, tribalism and ripeness for destruction in two years. Three years after that, the wicked were all wiped out. 

And it all fell apart with a single idea: murder to get gain. Sadly, that idea is now more popular than ever.

178 Years Ago

Having examined the ancient pattern established by Lucifer as a secret combination, its fundamental tenet of murder to get gain, and its modern application as the train careens wildly down the mountain toward the curve in the tracks, we should not fail to notice the pattern of murder among the religious. Just as killing political opponents often appears to the wicked as a solution to their problems and the path to gaining what they seek, so also it has always appeared to religious authorities as the path to freedom, power, control and wealth. 

True prophets have ever been threatened, abused, and killed for doing nothing other than teaching the truth. Because truth threatens the false institutions and power structures that have accumulated wealth and power, truth tellers become targets of the ambitious, the proud, the lustful, and the fearful. This played out 178 years ago today in an upper-floor room of a jailhouse in Carthage, Illinois, where two prophets sent by God to speak truth were murdered by a secret combination that lied about the deaths and gained a legacy of power, control, unbridled lust, and untold wealth built on the blood of the dead witnesses. 

Enough truth remained after the Smith brothers were gone to maintain a flicker in a darkening world. The Book of Mormon is a light that will not, indeed cannot, be extinguished, and together with the other revelations that came through Joseph and Hyrum Smith, truth gained a foothold in this fallen place. Their deaths were not in vain and will remain so as long as believers seek to rise up and know the God that manifested himself through these two witnesses. 

They trod the path that we must now follow. They laid the foundation upon which we must now build. Although the institution they left behind was immediately hijacked and corrupted by the very combination that conspired to kill them, enough of the truths they taught endured and caught the attention of others who would carry the work forward. The God of Heaven has now made a bonafide offer to continue what they started, rescue us from destruction and gather us to safety and peace. We are invited to know him as the Smith brothers did. Lucifer’s murderous combinations have reigned far too long with blood and horror on this earth.

I began this post by stating that when Christ came to the Nephites at Bountiful, he came to the surviving remnant of a destroyed nation. In the next and final installment we will consider the Lord’s promises, the current remnant, the destroyed nation, and how to be present when the Lord comes. The Book of Mormon is, after all, more prophecy than history.

Wherefore, the Lord commandeth you, when ye shall see these things come among you, that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful situation because of this secret combination which shall be among you; or woe be unto it because of the blood of them who have been slain, for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it, and also upon those who build it up.

—Ether 3:18 RE


  1. "It is an imperious duty that we owe to God, to angels with whom we shall be brought to stand, and also to ourselves, to our wives, and our children who have been made to bow down with grief, sorrow, and care under the most damning hand of murder, tyranny, and oppression, supported, and urged on, and upheld by the influence of that spirit which has so strongly riveted the creeds of the fathers, who have inherited lies upon the hearts of the children, and filled the world with confusion, and has been growing stronger and stronger, and is now the very mainspring of all corruption, and the whole earth groans under the weight of its iniquity. It is an iron yoke, it is a strong band; they are the very handcuffs, and chains, and shackles, and fetters of hell."

    Oh, the lies that are being told to further agendas today. Such mendacities as the world has never heard. And the whole earth, and her faithful, groan under the weight of that great yoke...

  2. That SPLC poll is really shocking! Maybe more so to me because I fall into the category of "older." It makes you wonder whatever did happen to Justice Scalia, doesn't it?

    Marcia H

    1. More of same. Justice Bryer and Chief Justice Roberts were recorded plotting Scalia's murder, according to sources connected with the conservative movement. That has not been released to the public obviously. Our courts' integrity have been breached for a very long time. Photos are circulating with Roberts and the Epstein crowd. Those are available online and are factual.

    2. To be sure, I'm not promoting the idea that the Supreme Court Justices are bastions of morality and truth, nor that the institutions of our nation are not thoroughly corrupt. What I am pointing out is that political assassinations are the hallmark of Satan's secret combination, and the Book of Mormon gives us repeated and urgent warnings about these ideas, which are now widely accepted and promoted. Our nation has already been destroyed, and the sweeping off yet remains. I fully expect the ideas I've highlighted here will be major contributors to that coming, final destruction.

    3. Trumps zombie army were literally calling for mike pence to be hung. They were absolutely prepared and had full intentions to carry it out. They were hunting (in every sense of the word)for democrat senators on Jan. 6. It’s on many videos. But I’m sure Jeff epsteins spectre edited those videos to look worse right? Good grief. The heavy implications this stuff is only happening on one political side is utter nonsense. How a blog that defends trumpism can post this is off the irony charts…

    4. Exactly! The one sided nature of this is crazy. I rolled my eyes and had to stop and laugh in at least 4 different places. Not to mention some of the comments....Roberts and and Bryer plotted Scalia's murder? My goodness.

    5. I don't believe this blog presents things as "only happening on one political side." This blog, in my view as a reader, doesn't venture into the false dichotomies of:  Right v. Left, or Repub v. Dem, or liberal v. conservative.

      The Book of Mormon gives the proper "sides": kingmen v freemen, or those who seek to control the People (authoritarians) v. those who promote Liberty. This true dichotomy is never talked about by the gov't or the MSM, and instead all that's presented is the false choices mentioned above, which have all been infiltrated by the Gaddiantons.

      Those oath-taking kingmen in fact RUN both sides. Our situation is "awful" indeed, but has been for almost all of the 20th century, starting in earnest with the creation of the private Gaddiaton central bank in 1913.

      One thing I think is particularly noteworthy: The secret combination that seeks to completely destroy liberty worldwide has been patiently rolling out its tyrannical plan by buying up armies and navies and false priests that oppress for many centuries.  There is one major event, however, that has recently occurred which the world doesn't comprehend and in fact rejects as significant.

      But the world's disregard of this event doesn't mean Satan disregards it.  What major event in earth's history happened and still flies below the world's radar, just as Jesus' birth was also unknown and unregarded by the world?

      It is the covenant that was offered in Sept 2017.

      The offered covenant and its repercussions are like holy water that has been thrown on a vampire's skin. He violently reacts in kind of a self defense spasm, because he knows his dear "kingdom" and his "greatness and glory" are threatened by God beginning to assert His governance. He fears God is wanting to take possession of the whole of it. Contrast the desperate actions of our rogue government today with the smug confidence they displayed over the last several hundred years, being able to patiently operate for "power and gain" unmolested, and mostly unexposed to the masses. But now Satan knows God is now at work to vindicate the covenants made to the fathers, and so with limited time, there is a palpable desperation to Satan's/ the globalists' actions now. 


    6. (part 2)

      To the normal person who observes an unfettered federal government, the actions of the corrupt politicians and UN leaders look quite insane: the war on carbon (global warming) and the "sustainable" push for clean energy, the warlike action of placing a gov't boot on the neck of the economy, the complete absence of indictments (much less justice) for brazen criminals, in-your-face election fraud that goes uninvestigated, calling American protestors "insurrectionists" and violent and destructive Antifa riots as "protests", branding patriotic protestors as terrorists and violent BLM thugs as peaceful protestors, mainstreaming gender dysphoria, the bold attack on our language to change reality by changing the content of words ("doublethink" in the novel 1984), the FBI threatening of parents for opposing communism (CRT) at local school boards, the flagrant attack on the basic right to life (meaning, the Covid lockdown measures that assault one's right to life/ work and the push to get everyone injected with unknown, unproven experimental gene therapy ingredients created by corporations given blanket immunity from prosecution), restricting domestic production of oil and coal when when both are abundant, the burning down of almost 100 food factories this year (obviously done at the direction of the criminal, rogue gov't -- the Gaddiantons), general good being called evil, and vice versa, etc., etc.).

      And these globalist actions ARE insane. And they are being done "in haste". These insane actions of the government are unavoidable now because of the desperation of Satan. He's about to lose his kingdom for 1,000 years. I think it's noteworthy that the covenant's offering is coincidental with all hell breaking loose in the world the last few years, and the frenetic pace we see the globalists now pushing. "Haste makes waste," as the saying goes. That's why it seems very plausible, to me, that the globalists have miscalculated with their Great Reset ambitions and timeline.

      They're pushing so hard, things may not come to pass as planned for their dystopian one-world government. If the end-times unfold according to the Nephite experience in 3 Nephi, many readers of the BoM will know, after the fact, how the book was an amazing blueprint warning to the inhabitants of this land, showing significant details of how the forcing of the Great Gaddianton Reset resulted in the possible unintended collapse of the U.S. government, ushering in a few years of "some degree ...[of] peace in the land." 

    7. “Patriotic protesters” There’s a laugh.

  3. Thank you Adrian! Just a little thought, yesterday the earth recorded its fastest day ever. 2022 is guaranteed to be the fastest year on record. The days are growing shorter and shorter. The time in the light is dwindling.

  4. I’m very much looking forward to your next and final installment. I hope you get destruction part 8 before the destruction

    1. Trying to time some future destruction is a fools errand in my view. We know it will come and signs can show the anticipation of prophecy. But God's timing is so far removed from our short sighted lifetime perspectives. Even believers in the inevitability of prophecy in the Book of Mormon being fulfilled on this land, should walk back any suggestion of knowledge about "timing." Such that it would motivate believers to put their lives on hold in any way. In an address to the Youth, Denver recommended (which was good advise) to continue to live your lives and pursue your educational goals, wether that be through vocational training, college, or other life goals. All of which will better inform the believer in world events as they unfold in apparent chaotic form in the future.

      Suggesting Adrian's next post may not make it in before the destruction occurs is hyperbolic to say the least. Perhaps you are being sarcastic but I've seen this sentiment in other places within the restoration movement. No one knows when. It requires faith to prepare and then wait. But it doesn't require turning into a full blown prepper in a bunker somewhere sure of the date and time.

    2. If you know McKay, you can see the smile on his face and wink as he makes his comment.
      Perhaps half in jest and half serious.
      Correct me if I am wrong please McKay

    3. I know McKay doesn't need anyone defending his comments. My purpose in commenting is as I read some of the comments on this blog post, it is so clear why we continue to struggle as a people, remnant or not. We seem to think it is productive to belittle and react to what others say as if we are the only one with a correct opinion. Name calling or accusing is an ineffective way of communicating and rarely produces positive results.

      Feel free to roll your eyes.

    4. I have a 16 yr old daughter who is in the phase of life where she is trying to make decisions about her future. When she attends conferences and witnesses hyperbolic rhetoric about the impending destruction of our society at any moment, it does damage to her hope of working towards anything meaningful in her future. If it's all going up in a ball of flames then what's the point. She is not alone among the youth whose parents are a part of this movement. I think it's wise to walk back claims of certainty about the timing of prophecy. After all, prophecy is not so we can know the exact method and time, but to be surprised by God's choosing of time and method--often by the simplest of means--so that after it occurs He can point to its fulfillment and proof that He knew how it would occur all along, and was in control of its fulfillment from the begining.

      As Mormons and former Mormons, especially hailing fromt the Utah-based echo chamber, we are prone to hyperbolic claims about what we know. We should have the humility to admit that we really have very little understanding about these subjects. We can observe the fig leaves and note that Spring is nigh, but not know any specifics beyond that. We can know--if we end up being accetpable in God's judgement--that all things will be fulfilled in One Generation. In Jewish terms, a generation was 40 years. There are those of advanced age within the movement who, I'd expect, would want to see the prophecies fulfilled in their lifetime. But it seems to me, the examples in scripture are that God is almost always interested in the long game--which transcends man's short mortal stay here. The point being, for at least our young adult and youth's sake, admitting our ignorance about what, when, and how allows them the space to live their lives without being paralyzed by a sense of hopelessness.

    5. The sentiment you see within the movement and the apparent hyperbole is actually people simply wishing (not necessarily McKay, but many many others) for the speedy destruction of the “wicked”. These people delight in the suffering of others and hope it’s real bad and real soon. That’s how far the movement is from a Zion people who “love one another as brothers and sisters indeed”. MANY literally delight in the misery of others. Sound like anyone we know?

    6. Russ, I agree that it's unwise and unproductive to make concrete predictions about timelines, destruction, dates, etc. I've tried to be very circumspect in refraining (and even disavowing) specific predictions. Obviously, we need to heed the Savior's counsel about watching for the signs and being ready.

      I don't think preparing for a bright future and recognizing our current predicament are mutually exclusive. I have teenage kids too, and we discuss the future, including their careers, education, hopes, dreams, and the possibility of living in a community of peace. There's a lot to look forward to.

    7. Anonymous, I literally don't know anyone like you describe, who delights in the suffering of others and hopes for the speedy destruction of the wicked. I'm not sure who you hang out with, but I'm certainly not aware of the "many, many" people you seem to know who feel this way. I'm mostly aware of people trying to to good, repent, learn, and become more like the Savior. To me, that is the hallmark of the movement. There may be a few bad apples, but I don't think it's accurate to impugn the whole movement because of a few crazies.

    8. Adrian, I've always thought you've approached these subjects circumspectetly. Its a fine balance talking about the apocalyptic and the hope for the future--especially among our youth. Stephanie Snuffer suggested in a recent podcast to, "act as if." In other words act is if there is time and to spare to pursue vocation, education, and family goals. Because living in a state of constant anticipation of the worst outcome just around the corner can be paralyzing and unhealthy--especially for our youth.

      Nephi, son of Helaman, exposed the secret combinations sitting in the chiefs seats of their government around the 70th year of the reign of judges. His prophecy about the Chief Judge being murdered by his brother, both secret members of their society, sent a shockwave through the society causing them to divide into factions based on the new light exposed by Nephi's witness. After that point the Giddiantons no longer occupied the chief seats of government but were rooted out of government. To ever after be inclined to set up their secret places in the mountains where they could attack small villages, steal the resources, and carry away the Nephite's women and children. But they could no longer hid in the tops of government positions and steal through taxation, corruption, and special interest. Although fractured, society lasted another 21 years before the sign of Christ's birth prophecied by Samuel the Lamanite. And then another 32 years before mass upheaval of the earth and the appearing of Christ to the people at Bountiful.

      In Mormon's record of his day, although he had been subjected to near constant warfare between his people and the Lamanites, in the process of being swept off there were periods of peace, or lulls that lasted up to a decade. As each side made further preparations for war. Both of these scriptural accounts point to the necessity to prepare and flee spiritual Babylon. But since we can't know the specifics of when to flee physical Babaylon, in many ways we should focus on preparing ourselves spiritually and then acting as if there is time to live your lives, pursue education, pursue opportunities to serve, gather resources to make the eventual temporal transition more realistic--without causing a burden on any other families making a similar attempt.

  5. I hope we can all allow the seriousness of our current situation and the approaching fulfillment of prophecy to provoke sincere and diligent action. The scriptures are more than just morningly pick-me-up platitudes. If we have the faith to first discover and then to act on what they're saying, we can bear fruit worthy of preservation.

    "...if righteousness returns and my people prove by their actions, words, and thoughts to yield to my spirit and hearken to my commandments, then will the earth rejoice, for the feet of those who cry peace upon her mountains are beautiful indeed, and I, the Lord, will bring again Zion, and the earth will rejoice." (T&C 157:65)

    Good post. The last paragraph is particularly worthy of attention.

  6. In the landmark TV series, Breaking Bad, a brilliant high school chemistry teacher, Walter White, turns to cooking crystal meth to pay for a growing mountain of medical bills arising from his lung cancer. As a viewer, I found myself suspending disbelief and rooting for him, admiring his determination and ingenuity. The arc of Walter's character, however, finds him growing into an accomplished criminal who comes to enjoy his newfound influence and power.

    The show became increasingly hard for me to watch as Walter discovers that murder is his go-to solution for the problems and challenges in his criminal enterprise. No surprise, then, that Walter is destroyed early in the story and eventually swept away by competing criminals in the series finale. A pity America won't learn the lesson of Walter White.

  7. The Book of Ether is fascinating to take a look at in view of our current time in history and in view of having a Brother of Jared among us who has wisely and unequivocally steered us away from adopting the strongman model, as he calls it, in our current unorganized state of the unfolding restoration 2.0. Though as he said in a post this week, it's his prerogative to organize it as he sees fit, in accordance with Adam.

    The Brother of Jared said at the very beginning of the Jaredite nation, just after arriving in the promised land, that the strongman model, which his kids, nieces and nephews desired, would "leadeth into captivity", which always results in death and destruction. The Jaredite prophets warned repeatedly of "a great destruction" to come, "such an one as never had been upon the face of the earth...except they...repent." (Ether 4:18 RE)

    The people never did fully repent, but there were some attempts at repentance after "many famines and pestilences...and great destruction". But ultimately, the people chose wickedness. Why did they "reject all the words of the prophets"? It was "because of their secret society and wicked abominations."

    In America, we are living just previous to being "swept off." And we have two records to guide us to avoid the coming carnage - the abridgements of the Nephite and Jaredite histories. 

    I am in the school of thought that the BoM is a prophecy of our day. The events recorded by Moroni are intended as a prophetic warning of what is to come. So when Denver prophesied this nation will end in fratricidal and genocidal warfare, that was already a given, if you view the BoM as a prophecy of our day. Both previous civilizations ended that way, and Mormon and Moroni made sure they spelled out the cause (Helaman 1:11, Ether 1:7 and 3:18 RE).

    So when the BoM says in Helaman 2:35 that the Gaddiantons (sic) obtained "the sole management of the government," that tells me that the top of the pyramid of every important gov't agency, and esp the three "separate" branches of government, have all been infiltrated and hijacked by these oath-taking Satan worshippers, not to exclude all corporations of any influence, from the LDS church to the NBA to the AMA. This hijacking of our gov't has been the case for likely MANY DECADES. Think about this. That means Congressional leaders in BOTH parties, and most if not all SCOTUS justices, and of course 100% of all presidents (executive branch) are Gaddianton brothers who "know" each other from their secret rites. We're talking about Satan-worshippers running not just the feds, but probably all state governorships as well. If you think there is an exception, like down there in Florida, just wait. I had said "just wait" for our last president to manifest his loyalty, and while he did look good for the first 3 years, his true loyalty to the NWO, the U.N., in short, the Gaddiantons, was made known in undeniable fashion during his 4th year as HE carefully piloted a savage economic attack on the Middle Class in conjunction with a devastating political attack on Liberty (Ether 3:19 RE), all in the name of a public "health" emergency. It was all rehearsed quite "on the record" in Event 201 just months in Oct of 2019 just weeks before the gov't/ media fearmongering commenced.

  8. You can bet that this Roe v. Wade reversal at the federal level HAS BEEN PLANNED at least since Trump/Hillary debate where Trump "predicted" the reversal. His 3 Gaddiantons (approved by Congress) were placed on the SCOTUS during Trump's tenure with orders to get the reversal done, all while egregiously standing down to defend Americans' right to bodily autonomy regarding the forced jab. If you think like a covenant-taking Gaddianton and read their published goals, then you see their genius, as law enforcement and the courts will allow gov't operatives and provocateurs to foment more violence and promote more fear, as the war against Christianity is ramped up. Things are building towards a coming crescendo of civil war. Fear appears to be the #1 goal of the Gaddianton media. Just keep striking fear into the hearts of the people. Fear. Fear. Fear. Create fear, create a problem, then propose the solution. But will it go according to their plan?

    Interestingly, again, if you look at the BoM as a type, there are times in the BoM when the people fought back against the Gaddiantons. See Ether 4:20 RE for an example. Seems the conditions today may be ripe for there to "[arise] a rebellion among the people because of that secret combination." The evil and corruption of those in power is so transparent and not even attempted to be hidden now, that the People (albeit largely unrepentant) might actually rise up in some fashion. God said he will shake Babylon. Might the disintegration of the gov't be in the cards, as was recorded by Mormon here:  "And the people were divided one against another and they did separate one from another into tribes, every man according to his family, and his kindred, and friends; and thus they did destroy the government of the land." (3 Nephi 3:6 RE)

    I may not have the imagination, but I have never been able to contemplate a scenario with the Gaddiantons occupying the "sole management" of the government, where a New Jerusalem could co-exist with a Gaddianton-run federal gov't. To me, Waco 2.0 is inevitable (though this time God would defend His "compound", but would God want such a sensational story to go forth to the world?), under the premise the Gaddiantons have "sole management" of the gov't. So either the New Jerusalem remains unknown and the gathering is secret to all but the gathered, or the current gov't must fall. If the BoM is a "hidden in plain view" prophecy by type, then it makes sense, to me, that the unhinged, accelerated (truly being done now "in haste") work of the Gaddiantons to get power and gain by doing all the stuff you see in the news will backfire on them. Moving forward with Agenda 2030 and the Great Reset may be one colossal MISCALCULATION that will result in "sufficient time to build a house unto me." (T&C 141:11). The time may not be lengthy (same deal offered to the Nauvoo saints), but nevertheless is would be "sufficient" because there is "some degree [of] peace in the land" (3 Nephi 3:8) even after the government collapses either on purpose or by Gaddianton miscalculation. These words may be close:  "But I command you, all you my saints, to build a house unto me, and I grant unto you a sufficient time to build a house unto me."

    "Some degree [of] peace in the land" may look like an actual time of prosperity and normalcy, "They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark and the flood came and destroyed them all." Luke 10:3 RE. 

  9. Underdog2 - this video starts to show what you are referring to.

    1. Thanks, Mark, I just watched the video along with 1/3 of a million of others. The Gaddiantons are TRYING to get people angry (watch 10-sec confession of one of them from that video you quoted):

      The following is an EXTREMELY interesting insight in the BoM (2 Nephi 7:3 at

      "Wherefore, for this cause, that my covenants may be fulfilled which I have made unto the children of men, that I will do unto them while they are in the flesh, I must needs destroy the secret works of darkness, and of murders, and of abominations. Wherefore, he that fighteth against Zion, both Jew and Gentile, both bond and free, both male and female, shall perish; for they are they who are the whore of all the earth. For they who are not for me are against me, saith our God. For I will fulfill my promises which I have made unto the children of men that I will do unto them while they are in the flesh."

      "That his covenants may be fulfilled..." -- "Remnant" believers understand better what this is referring to. A major covenant was offered in Sept 2017. Assuming that covenant is referenced in this verse, that means the verse takes on new meaning to readers.

      "...I must needs destroy the secret works of darkness" -- This is a FUTURE event. It hasn't occurred yet. This then must mean that it is necessary the LORD destroys the Gaddiantons to a degree that suits Him. Wouldn't that at least mean breaking the grip of power the Gaddiantons now enjoy over the world/ America/ at least the American West (that most of the fed gov't owns and upon which Zion is to be located)?

      And then for the bombshell in the next sentence where this prophecy indicates there will be those, PRESUMABLY THE GADDIANTONS (who are really pissed that their kingdom is being meddled with), who fight against "Zion".

      Heretofore, "Zion" in LDS eyes has meant some from of the LDS Church. But that's an incorrect reading. It means something much more "to the remnant" (no pun intended). It likely has reference to the New Jerusalem. Which means that it has to be established and be inhabited by some number of people, worthy to get the attention of the Gaddiantons to "fight against" it.

      Several pieces of the puzzle appears to be revealed here, now that we know about the new latter-day covenant offered.

      God says He "will fulfill his promises" relative to his established covenant, and by saying the Gaddiantons / those who "fight against Zion...shall perish", that is I believe what Denver has in mind when he says that if God chooses the location, HE will defend it. Why? Because HE will fulfill his promises and covenants. "If you fight against Me, you're gonna perish."

      Which appears to be a future fulfillment of this promise to Enoch (and a future Zion people) in which the power of God will "...put at defiance the armies of nations."

    2. @underdog what do think the "covenants being fulfilled" actually means? And who does it pertaining to?

    3. I'll open that to anyone in the group as it appears Underdog2 is tied up. I'm slightly confused as to the consensus of this blog series? What can we expect next?

    4. Death! Destruction! Total annihilation!! …Excellent (said in Mr. Burns voice)

    5. What does “covenants being fulfilled” actually mean?

      See paragraph 2 of the Answer to the prayer for covenant. I “covenanted” with Adam at the beginning. What is the relationship of Jesus Christ and Adam, the first man? Why, then, is “the last Adam” something that is used to describe Christ? Is an accurate description of Christ simply a singular male being? How could this be the case if He is in the express “image” of His “Father”? If you want an answer to your question, I recommend a very deep study of the talk “Our Divine Parents”.

    6. Anonymous, I appreciate you trying to answer the question posed to Underdog2! The question was more specifically linked to a couple of scriptures he quoted.

      He wrote: "Wherefore, for this cause, that my covenants may be fulfilled which I have made unto the children of men, that I will do unto them while they are in the flesh, I must needs destroy the secret works of darkness, and of murders, and of abominations.

      "That his covenants may be fulfilled..." -- "Remnant" believers understand better what this is referring to..."

      He's referring to the covenant being fulfilled through Denver Snuffer after calling the LDS church to repentance. But this has already occurred and yet Underdog states: "
      "...I must needs destroy the secret works of darkness" -- This is a FUTURE event. It hasn't occurred yet."

      So, my question is what does he or the group think this actually means?

      I understand the generalization you're suggesting that the Lord wants to establish covenants with his children but that is a very broad answer. Perhaps you don't know what this really means, or what Underdog2 was thinking. I'm just curious if anyone is making a claim to know? The comments seem to echo a troubling grasp for understanding with no one offering further light on the subject.

      This blog series is a lot of "doom & gloom" & as quoted above by someone in the group "Death! Destruction! Total annihilation".

      I don't see it that way at all!

    7. You don’t understand at all what I’m suggesting, because it is incredible specific and not at all a generalization. We have “Our Divine Parents”, the scriptures, and Joseph’s testimony. It’s there.

    8. So you're stepping up to clarify the suggested meaning by not clarifying but by generalizations that are very specific. Nice!

    9. Some things, many things, are not for me to tell people

    10. I'm curious too! So it's too sacred to share?

    11. Well not exactly because it’s in the scriptures and the material I referenced plain as day.

      Why would anyone believe anything a random, unimportant stranger on the internet says if they won’t believe it out of the scriptures?

    12. Enlightening. thank you! I'll check out the scriptures.

  10. Andrew Smith asked me to post this comment because the site wasn't posting it properly:


    Don't forget Samuel Smith. He was murdered along with his brothers - it just took a little longer. His death, as much as that of Joseph and Hyrum, shows the depth of the conspiracy and provides some insight into who gained from the murders, and how close they were to the Smith family, and how brazen they were in their power grab.


    One thing I find interesting about the Nephites and their decline before Christ's appearance, is that church leaders (note the use of "high priest") collaborated with the state in persecuting the prophets. This from chapter 6 (LDS version):

    20 And there began to be men inspired from heaven and sent forth, standing among the people in all the land, preaching and testifying boldly of the sins and iniquities of the people, and testifying unto them concerning the redemption which the Lord would make for his people, or in other words, the resurrection of Christ; and they did testify boldly of his death and sufferings.

    21 Now there were many of the people who were exceedingly angry because of those who testified of these things; and those who were angry were chiefly the chief judges, and they who had been high priests and lawyers; yea, all those who were lawyers were angry with those who testified of these things.

    22 Now there was no lawyer nor judge nor high priest that could have power to condemn any one to death save their condemnation was signed by the governor of the land.



  11. In light of Denver's recent interview with Steve Pynakker, I am encouraged that we strike a balance when dealing with apocalypticism.

    Does planning for the future mean being fully integrated with Babylon or . . . working with Babylon on the periphery but making contingency plans?

    A great example may be thus: given the time, and resources available to us, for those that have the means, do we live in palatial homes deep in the suburbs or cities, with paid groundskeepers, no gardens, and totally reliant upon the supply chain, in neighborhoods that support the destruction of personal freedom or . . . do we sell all we have to live in an RV on some desert plot far away from civilization or . . . do we strive to get out of debt, exchange equity to live in modest homes, using our property to prepare by planting gardens and storing food, prepare for an escape plan, living in loose communities of likeminded, without compromising our jobs, careers, educational pursuits, or planting 40 years of cherry trees?

    Another . . . do we continue to pursue careers that have us uproot to far-flung areas far from communities of likeminded in order to get that next brass ring, or . . . do we quit our jobs and hope to live off the land or . . . do we find adequate employment, perhaps remote work, where we free to live anywhere the Lord inspires us to move, free from the constraints of employment?

    Finally . . . do we consider that our current communities have the necessary elements of proximity to allow us to rely upon one another in a daily fashion? Do we feel that living within a half-hour's or more drive with Zoom and chat capabilities will get us through difficult times? Or do we think we must move every family in our community to a compound in the desert right now or . . . do we strive to live in closer communities where distance is less of an issue, but we still have the capacity to minister to others not in our community nearby as the Lord dictates?

    1. “Neighborhoods that support the destruction of personal freedom”.

      Honestly wtf does that even mean?!


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