tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post2135330277207916831..comments2024-03-26T14:29:25.921-06:00Comments on To The Remnant: All that Glitters, Part 2: Ornaments of GoldAdrian Larsenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17173995703995901609noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-51689939983411222812015-06-17T07:32:20.731-06:002015-06-17T07:32:20.731-06:00The One Mighty and Strong is Native American indee...The One Mighty and Strong is Native American indeed and Zions prepratory place will be in the southwest and then the New Jerusal will come down from heaven and that will be im missouri (imo) The Choice Seer is an Indian and posseses the staff of Moses and Brass plates and will build the Zion prepratory place. <br />Great references Kathryn, thanks.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15581327263834301481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-27120815322714228252015-06-17T07:22:45.838-06:002015-06-17T07:22:45.838-06:00Agreed, times of the Gentiles is fulfilled and the...Agreed, times of the Gentiles is fulfilled and the natural branch will begin to usher in the last days. The seed of Lehi, the covenant people, them that will soon 'blossom like a rose', very exciting and sad at the same time for the drunkards of ephraimAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15581327263834301481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-22262214898934505232015-06-17T07:19:27.635-06:002015-06-17T07:19:27.635-06:00Time of the gentiles has passed. Remnant now will...Time of the gentiles has passed. Remnant now will take the lead and awaken then bring down city if enochAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15581327263834301481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-70291423864932651132015-06-10T12:46:50.904-06:002015-06-10T12:46:50.904-06:00In support of Adrian’s comments, I thought this wo...In support of Adrian’s comments, I thought this would give additional insight into <br />Joseph’s understanding of the importance of the Remnant. <br /><br />Joseph Smith Diary Entry: Thursday May 23, 1844 (1 month before his death)<br /><br />“1 p.m. held council with the Indians - Sac & Fox in my back kitchen.<br />I replied.... Great Spirit wants you to be united and live in peace. I found a book, (presenting the book of Mormon) which told me about your fathers & Great Spirit told me you must send to all the tribes you can and tell them then to live in peace, and when any of our people come to see you treat them as we treat you.”<br /><br />Ronald W. Walker, Historian. Journal of Book of Mormon History Vol. 19, Issue 1 Spring 1993<br /><br />“There were a few last events that gave his (Joseph Smith) career a symmetry. He had begun to be preoccupied by the Lamanite and interested in the West, and his final days had similar themes. Five days before his death, Smith and his closets associates passed over the Mississippi River. <br /><br />.... standing on a “Tall House Frame,” (he) spoke to his followers before going to fateful Carthage. <br /><br />“You will yet be called upon to go to the stronghold of the Rocky Mountains”<br /><br />Smith predicted.<br /><br />"You will gather the Red man...from their scattered and dispersed situation to become the strong arm of Jehovah.”<br /><br />On a personal note: I thing this give further credence to the Heartland Model of the geography of the Book of Mormon rather than the Mesoamerica setting. <br />Kathrynhttp://webpressutah.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-80125322937097712392015-06-09T12:40:41.421-06:002015-06-09T12:40:41.421-06:00Adrian, I appreciate this post. Until we wake up ...Adrian, I appreciate this post. Until we wake up and realize the state of our own idolatry, we cannot come to know the truth of our Savior and be received by Him. I think 3 Nephi 16 is also applicable here, especially verse 10, where Jesus is prophesying about what will be amongst the Gentiles to whom He has given His gospel. The "whoredoms" He mentions here, as He is speaking to a branch of the house of Israel, would be idolatry: in other words, unfaithfulness to Christ.<br /><br />I only recently discovered your blog, but I have been reading it (mostly in order) and really appreciate the truths here and the personal call to repentance it has helped me receive. Thank you.<br />--DianeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-16404881554233438862015-06-09T11:44:49.135-06:002015-06-09T11:44:49.135-06:00To add one more thing to Adrian's response:
E...To add one more thing to Adrian's response:<br /><br />Every time the Church of Christ has been established, whether recorded in the Book of Mormon or Bible, there has been "no poor among them". That is a hallmark of true followers of Jesus Christ. (Which is why I find Harvest Evangelism's ministry so beautiful: they gauge their success by the elimination of systemic poverty.)<br /><br />Joseph Smith followed God's instructions to try to help the saints understand what was necessary if they wanted to have outpourings of the Spirit, which are withheld when a people are not equal in temporal things (D&C 70:14). So, the Remnant had to be found, and Joseph wanted the Gentile people prepared to join them.Annaleahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12964274663555911996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-20660894526728529572015-06-09T09:49:29.206-06:002015-06-09T09:49:29.206-06:00Hi Christian,
Great question. Thanks for asking. ...Hi Christian,<br /><br />Great question. Thanks for asking. <br /><br />As you may know, the first missionaries sent by the church were sent to the Lamanites, in an attempt to locate the remnant so Zion could be established. <br /><br />Doctrine and Covenants 28: 8-9, "And now, behold, I say unto you that you shall go unto the Lamanites and preach my gospel unto them; and inasmuch as they receive thy teachings thou shalt cause my church to be established among them; and thou shalt have revelations, but write them not by way of commandment. And now, behold, I say unto you that it is not revealed, and no man knoweth where the city Zion shall be built, but it shall be given hereafter. Behold, I say unto you that it shall be on the borders by the Lamanites."<br /><br />Our current version says: "on the borders by the Lamanites." If you go to the Joseph Smith Papers and look at the original Revelation, it was revised. What Joseph Smith originally received as a Revelation says, "it shall be among the Lamanites." Then in the handwriting of Sidney Rigdon, "among" is eliminated, and "on the borders by" is inserted in its place. So the first missionaries were sent to be "among" the Lamanites where the city of Zion would be located. This was an odd priority indeed for a fledgling church Joseph Smith founded in upstate New York.<br /><br />The reasons for the change are too lengthy to go into here, but they are covered in Denver Snuffer's lecture 6, on Zion. The effort in Missouri is explained there.<br /><br />It's also worth noting that when Joseph fled Nauvoo to save his life in 1844, he was headed to the Rocky mountains to locate the remnant so Zion could be established. But as you know, he was persuaded to come back, and was killed. <br /><br />Joseph was fully aware of the requirement that the remnant of Jacob establish Zion and he made concerted efforts to locate them and begin the process. Adrian Larsenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173995703995901609noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-58817826353975658932015-06-09T05:02:33.924-06:002015-06-09T05:02:33.924-06:00If Zion is to be built by the remnant of the house...If Zion is to be built by the remnant of the house of Jacob, then why did Joseph try to establish Zion?Christianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17472278874852515384noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-74188801358180765922015-06-08T03:41:42.104-06:002015-06-08T03:41:42.104-06:00An Open Letter to Elder Holland
Dear Elder Holla...An Open Letter to Elder Holland <br /><br />Dear Elder Holland, <br /><br />I second what Adrian has written on this topic, and I have some additional thoughts to add. <br /><br />It is tragic that you use the phrase "What a secure thought!" in a positive and exclamatory way, in reference to the idea that the mortal, corporate entity in which you play a non-trivial role can never fail -- that the priesthood is somehow inseparably connected with an institution, rather than with righteousness -- as if the mainstream leadership of the Church is invincible and can never fall outside the favor of God. It would be difficult to find a more exact match than your words with regard to the warned against attitudes in 2 Nephi 28.<br /><br />In 1972, then Elder Benson recommended a book "Many are Called but Few are Chosen" (http://www.inspiredconstitution.org/books.html), in a speech called Civic Standards for the Faithful Saints. <br /><br />Part of his speech was idolatrous ("always-worship-the-living-president-of-the-Church"), but the book he recommends nonetheless makes an accurate observation about our near total apostasy from the principles of liberty that underpin the gospel of Christ. <br /><br />Elder Benson later recommended another book by the same author (Hans Andersen), in a letter responding to a member who was asking about Many are Called. The name of this other book is The Great and Abominable Church of the Devil. In chapter 18 of this book, (http://www.inspiredconstitution.org/hva_great/chapter_18.html), the apostasy is again explicitly outlined. <br /><br />Another aspect of our downfall has been our apostasy from teaching faith in Christ, to teaching faith in mortal men. Carnally pleasing ideas like the ones below should have no place among disciples of Christ:<br /><br />“The Saints can have faith in their leaders and vote unanimously on all propositions, knowing that the things presented for their sustaining vote were approved of the Lord to their leaders before being presented to the membership of the Church” (Ensign, May 1974, Alma P. Burton, BYU Professor of Church History and Doctrine).<br /><br />"We will not lead you astray. We cannot. ...Keep your eyes riveted on the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles." Elder M.Russel Ballard, December 1996 Ensign<br /><br />Instead, we should be teaching faith in this way:<br /><br />“You must work through the Spirit. If that leads you into conflict with the program of the Church, you follow the voice of the Spirit.” (Elder Seymour B. Young, First Quorum of the Seventy 1882-1924).<br /><br />“If we have presidents or apostles or anybody that we do not like, let us vote them out, and be free men, and cultivate and cherish in our bosoms the principles of liberty.” (John Taylor, 7 October 1872; “Discourse,” The Deseret News Weekly, volume 21, number 48.)<br /><br />"And if thine eye which seeth for thee, him that is appointed to watch over thee to show thee light, become a transgressor and offend thee, pluck him out." Mark 9:46, JST<br /><br />Zion is burning while you and others with high titles proclaim that all is well. If you are willing to dig deeply into these issues, you will find that all is not well. There is a darkness of mind within the Church. Most members do not take some of their most important responsibilities seriously (cross ref Joseph Smith's Ezekiel 14 warning).<br /><br />I hope and pray that some day we will get past this darkness, and begin to respect the duties that devolve upon us. We are in deep apostasy.<br /><br />I admire your testimony of the Book of Mormon. I have felt the Spirit attend many of your speeches -- at least portions of them. I pray that you will be willing to exercise greater loyalty to the Spirit and follow it no matter the cost. I pray that you will stop upholding the idolatry and false security that currently dominate our culture. <br /><br />Sincerely,<br /><br />-Joe Murff <br /><br />Joe Murffnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-30780473803817218702015-06-07T12:17:40.171-06:002015-06-07T12:17:40.171-06:002 Nephi 28 testifies against the LDS church: "...2 Nephi 28 testifies against the LDS church: "they have all gone astray save it be a few, who are the humble followers of Christ; nevertheless, they are led, that in many instances they do err because they are taught by the precepts of men". This was me, and is the so-called true believing Mormons. That WHOLE chapter condemns the Mormon church, but we teach it talks about other people, not us, and we grow in pride. Nathan Lyneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07084625673180290992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-54796001198402630152015-06-07T10:29:44.117-06:002015-06-07T10:29:44.117-06:00About 2 years ago, someone pointed out that WE, LD...About 2 years ago, someone pointed out that WE, LDS, are considered gentiles. (D&C 109:60) and are not considered anything special. D&C 1:1 does not call us "His" people but "Ye" people of my church. I had never understood this before. With this insight, the Book of Mormon has unfold itself differently for me, especially 3rd Nephi, where he call those descendants of Jacob "His" people. <br /><br />It is now my understanding that the "Remnant" is not the LDS people but a "Remnant" of those Book of Mormon people Christ was talking to. The last verse in 4th Nephi (4 Nephi 1:49) seems to support this point of view. However, those who are faithful to the teachings of Christ will be ask to join them and become a member of the "Remnant" in the last days to prepare for His Coming. If I am wrong in this understanding, I invite correction.<br /><br />This past year, I have been reading the Book of Mormon as a "Gentile", and with this new insight it has not only opened new understanding but humbled me as I have taken the warnings personally. <br /><br />Adrian, as you have pointed out in these verses (2 Nephi 28:8-9, 21-22) we LDS people are in the mix of those being warned. It's not hard to tie Elder Holland's words, "There is no need to be afraid or tentative about the future", into this very warning. Kathrynhttp://webpressutah.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-88349151429575654772015-06-07T06:37:12.218-06:002015-06-07T06:37:12.218-06:00Great post, Adrian.
Chapter 3 of "Come, let...Great post, Adrian. <br /><br />Chapter 3 of "Come, let us adore Him" is something we all need to read again and become very familiar with. It's entitled "Chosen People." It shows the pattern of success and failure of God's "chosen" ones. It could also be very prophetic for our future if we get it right...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-12373895378452480662015-06-06T22:22:31.018-06:002015-06-06T22:22:31.018-06:00Only recently have I begun to study the scripture ...Only recently have I begun to study the scripture with REAL intent and with an open heart. Up until this point I have passed over these warnings, reading them dozens of times. Who did I think they were talking about? I feel like I have been reading an entirely new Book of Mormon recently and it has been good for my soul.<br />- tgAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8665085267750808287.post-81240783541626355562015-06-06T21:02:54.817-06:002015-06-06T21:02:54.817-06:00TRUTH! I thank God for the warnings given in the B...TRUTH! I thank God for the warnings given in the Book of Mormon!!! Great post Adrian!Nathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06839642191634986903noreply@blogger.com